Key Moments
Noah Kagan Interview (Full Episode) | The Tim Ferriss Show (Podcast)
Tim FerrissKey Moments
Noah Kagan shares productivity hacks, business strategies, and life advice, emphasizing action and simple rules.
Key Insights
Optimize productivity by speeding up your mouse and keyboard settings and using tools like Alfred.
Prioritize ruthlessly using frameworks like 'Essentialism' to focus on what truly matters.
Build an email list from day one by leveraging existing social networks and personal connections.
Develop simple, repeatable rules for business and personal life to ensure consistent progress.
Embrace asking for things, even small discounts, to build confidence and overcome self-imposed limitations.
Focus on consistency and making small, deliberate actions daily, like making your bed, to build momentum.
OPTIMIZING PRODUCTIVITY AND WORKFLOW
Noah Kagan emphasizes immediate productivity gains through simple tech adjustments. Speeding up mouse tracking and keyboard settings can significantly enhance computer navigation. He recommends tools like Alfred for Mac users, which streamlines app launching, contact searching, and even basic calculations, reducing the need to switch between applications or use the mouse. For those easily distracted, browser extensions like Facebook Newsfeed Eradicator can create a more focused work environment by eliminating common time-wasting websites.
STRATEGIC BUSINESS BUILDING AND GROWTH
Kagan advocates for a laser focus on one primary goal, inspired by Mark Zuckerberg's approach at Facebook. This involves breaking down the main objective into monthly and daily targets, visualized on a simple dashboard. This singular focus ensures that every decision and action aligns with the overarching goal, making the team more effective and efficient. This principle is also applied to personal life, encouraging individuals to identify their most important activities and schedule them consistently.
THE POWER OF ASKING AND OVERCOMING FEAR
A core strategy shared by Kagan is the 'Coffee Challenge'—simply asking for 10% off at a coffee shop. This exercise, though seemingly trivial, is designed to help individuals overcome the fear of asking and to realize that many limitations are self-imposed. He stresses that putting yourself out there and advocating for needs, whether it's a discount or a business deal, is crucial for progress. This mindset is transferable to more significant asks, like seeking advice or pitching ideas, making people more comfortable with uncertainty.
BUILDING AND LEVERAGING AN EMAIL LIST
Kagan passionately advocates for building an email list from the start, highlighting its significance as a primary driver for businesses, including his own seven-figure ventures. He provides a practical, free method: posting a photo on social media announcing a new newsletter, asking people to email a specific address (or a custom Gmail address like 'yourname+topic@gmail.com') to subscribe. This immediate action leverages existing social networks and personal contacts to create a direct communication channel for future messages or product launches.
EMBRACING SIMPLE RULES AND CONSISTENCY
Kagan champions the creation of simple, actionable rules for both business and personal development, such as the '411' rule for AppSumo (four deals, one free deal, one internal promotion per month). He encourages listeners to establish their own weekly or daily checklists, like writing a blog post or making a sales call. This approach, combined with regular accountability check-ins (daily or weekly with a partner or team), significantly increases the likelihood of achieving goals and maintaining momentum.
LIFELONG LEARNING AND PERSONAL GROWTH
Reading is a fundamental habit for successful individuals, according to Kagan. He also stresses the importance of mentors and learning from those who have achieved what you aspire to. His advice to his younger self includes actively seeking out mentors, offering to work for free, and immersing oneself in the desired field by working for companies they admire. He also promotes learning through various mediums, including YouTube and curated reading lists, emphasizing curiosity and continuous self-improvement.
FINANCIAL LITERACY AND PRACTICAL ADVICE
Kagan touches on the often-undervalued importance of personal finance, copywriting, and selling. He suggests organizing money by denomination as a sign of respect for financial resources. For copywriting, he recommends studying free resources like Gary Halbert's letters and seeking editors to refine writing skills. He underscores that mastering these skills is critical for entrepreneurial success and effective communication.
HEALTH, WELLNESS, AND PHYSICAL TOOLS
Optimizing physical well-being is presented as key to overall performance. This includes investing in comfortable bedding, quality shoes, and utilizing fitness tracking apps like MyFitnessPal for precise dietary management. Kagan also discusses the benefits of specific diets for cognitive function and shares his experience with bulking and gaining muscle, emphasizing the need for sufficient protein intake and consistent, heavy lifting. He also highlights the importance of physical tools like a NutriBullet blender for efficient meal preparation.
THE VALUE OF NON-TRADITIONAL SUCCESS METRICS
Drawing from books like 'Small Giants,' Kagan challenges the conventional Silicon Valley focus on hyper-growth and massive funding. He celebrates companies that prioritize quality, niche markets, and customer satisfaction over sheer scale. This perspective empowers entrepreneurs to build sustainable businesses that align with their personal values and lifestyle, rather than chasing external validation or arbitrary metrics of success.
MASTERING THE SCIENCE OF SELLING AND POSITIONING
Kagan delves into sales methodologies, recommending 'SPIN Selling' (Situation, Problem, Implication, Need-Payoff) as a framework for understanding customer needs deeply. He also highlights 'The Sales Acceleration Formula' for SaaS-based selling and 'Million-Dollar Consulting' for service-based businesses. A critical concept is positioning: being different, not just better, to capture attention in a crowded market. He encourages proactive selling by offering value first, such as creating unsolicited work for potential clients or mentors.
CULTIVATING CURIOSITY AND EXPERIENCES
Inspired by Richard Feynman's life and work, Kagan champions a mindset of relentless curiosity. He advises embracing new experiences, not fearing judgment, and continuously challenging oneself—whether it's learning a new skill or exploring unconventional ideas. This attitude fosters a richer, more fulfilling life and often leads to unexpected innovations and personal breakthroughs.
THE MENTALITY OF STRENGTH TRAINING AND DIETING
Kagan shares his journey of intentionally gaining significant muscular mass, stressing that sustainable physical transformation requires a strong foundation of consistent healthy eating habits and meticulous tracking, often for a year or more. He advocates for doubling calorie intake and focusing on high-protein foods, especially when facing plateaus. Accountability partners and consistent weight monitoring via smart scales are vital tools for this demanding process.
STRATEGIC COMMUNICATION AND NETWORKING
Effective communication means doing your homework before reaching out. Instead of generic requests for mentorship, Kagan suggests offering specific value, such as creating helpful content or providing a service, to stand out. He advises keeping communications concise and actionable, using the 'one-thumb rule' for mobile readability. Don't take lack of response personally; assume busyness or other factors, and maintain integrity by clearly communicating intentions and expectations.
BUILDING RESILIENCE AND ADAPTABILITY
Kagan emphasizes that it's acceptable to abandon projects or pivot strategies, especially when they no longer serve your primary goals or bring joy. He cites examples of refunding customers and shutting down ventures that became too burdensome. This flexibility allows for continuous experimentation and ensures that efforts remain aligned with overarching objectives, preventing burnout and maintaining enthusiasm for ongoing endeavors.
Mentioned in This Episode
●Supplements
●Products
●Software & Apps
●Companies
●Organizations
●Books
●Studies Cited
●Concepts
●People Referenced
Noah Kagan's Productivity and Life Optimization Tips
Practical takeaways from this episode
Do This
Avoid This
Common Questions
Noah Kagan moved to Austin for its affordability compared to the Bay Area, attractive lifestyle, outdoor activities, and vibrant social scene. He describes it as a place where he didn't want to be constantly surrounded by startup talks and found a better life balance.
Topics
Mentioned in this video
A YouTube video featuring Richard Feynman, recommended by Tim Ferriss.
A film praised for its good revenge plot, recommended by Noah Kagan.
A documentary recommended by Tim Ferriss about competitive video gaming.
A documentary about Jiro Ono, a sushi master in Tokyo, whose commitment to his craft over scaling his business serves as an example of the 'Small Giants' philosophy.
A documentary about Robert Durst, highly recommended by Noah Kagan for its mind-blowing ending.
A TV competition show mentioned as a platform for athletes like Travis Brewer.
A TV show where Noah Kagan co-taught an episode on building a business, leading a novice entrepreneur to launch her business in one week. Contains bonus footage with sales and marketing tips.
A 'horrible' Arnold Schwarzenegger movie that is Noah Kagan's favorite film from his childhood.
A documentary recommended by Tim Ferriss about high-wire artist Philippe Petit.
A technology company mentioned as having originated in Austin, Texas.
A financial software company that acquired Mint.com.
A biofuel company founded by Willie Nelson, jokingly mentioned as a notable company from Austin.
A pharmacy chain where keto sticks can be purchased.
A mattress company offering super comfortable mattresses, considered by Noah Kagan for an upgrade to optimize his bed for better sleep.
An online coaching service run by Adam, who serves as Noah Kagan's accountability partner for fitness goals, helping him gain and lose weight and consistently review progress.
Noah Kagan's favorite taco restaurant in Austin, Texas, known for being a successful business that chose not to scale aggressively, focusing on quality over quantity.
A social networking service where Noah Kagan was employee number 30. Mentioned as a company that started small and had growth as its primary goal.
An online platform for interviews with entrepreneurs, founded by Andrew Warner.
A web browser, used as an example for quick launching with Alfred App.
Noah Kagan's main business, focused on providing deals for entrepreneurs and a high-seven-figure business largely driven by email marketing.
A Texas-based distillery that produces 'Balcones Single Malt', which Noah Kagan claims is the number one whiskey in the world.
A technology company whose headquarters are near where Noah Kagan grew up in the Bay Area.
A cloud storage company, used as an example of a SaaS (Software as a Service) business.
A software company Tim Ferriss almost worked for after college, which could have led him to move to Austin.
A social media platform used by Noah and Tim to follow fitness personalities and gymnasts for motivation and workout ideas, especially when feeling lazy.
A major tech company that rejected Noah Kagan twice, leading him to believe he was meant to run his own businesses.
An online payment system that Peter Thiel co-founded and where he also famously invested early money into Facebook.
A company providing bedding, used by Noah Kagan for a combination to improve his sleep quality.
A professional networking platform, mentioned as a tool to filter through people when looking for sales leads.
A social media platform co-founded by Evan Williams, mentioned as one of his repeated successful ventures.
A company run by Bryan, who stands out by doing actual work for people (like making videos or marketing plans) before asking for anything in return.
A video-sharing platform used by Noah Kagan for learning and watching videos from influential figures like Richard Feynman and Elon Musk.
A music streaming service where Noah Kagan maintains a workout playlist he offers to share.
A scheduling tool that connects to calendars and allows users to set specific preferences for meetings, avoiding back-and-forth emails. Recommended by Noah and Tim.
A design platform for graphic design needs, used by Tim Ferriss for banner ads and book covers, including 'The 4-Hour Body', for which it provided sketches and mockups.
A content publishing platform co-founded by Evan Williams, demonstrating his consistent success in business creation.
A writing app, used and liked by Tim Ferriss, mentioned as a tool for improving writing quality.
A free productivity app for Mac that allows users to launch apps, find contacts, and do math with a simple command bar, making computer navigation faster than Spotlight.
A free webcam tool for remote teams, allowing continuous visual connection to improve communication and team cohesion.
A feature in Gmail that allows users to enable 'canned responses' for automated email replies and filters.
An email marketing service, mentioned as an option for list management but advised to simplify and use email directly for initial list building.
An email reminder service described as a 'Jewish mother in an inbox' that sends reminders based on a BCC address (e.g., 'oneday@followup.cc'), ensuring nothing is forgotten.
A collaborative document editing software used by Noah Kagan and his inner circle for peer editing and feedback on articles before publication.
A blog publishing service co-founded by Evan Williams, cited as an example of his repeated successes.
A personal finance company where Noah Kagan was employee number 4, which was later acquired by Intuit.
A platform co-founded by Noah Kagan that offers free tools to help grow web traffic and email lists. Its primary goal is to hit a certain revenue target.
A daily tracking app for food intake, used by Noah Kagan to monitor calories and macronutrients for weight gain and loss goals, and to provide accountability.
A website where Noah Kagan gets mixtapes for his hardcore rap workout playlist.
A writing editor app, mentioned as a tool for improving writing quality.
A Chrome extension that blocks the Facebook newsfeed, preventing distraction and increasing productivity. Noah Kagan, a former Facebook employee, uses it frequently.
Author of 'SmartCuts', known for his experimentation with Soylent and for advising that interviewing people is a great way to get a mentor or meet anyone.
A marketing expert mentioned for his simple and effective strategies for monetizing email lists.
Sushi master featured in 'Jiro Dreams of Sushi', known for his dedication to perfecting his craft rather than scaling his restaurant.
Author of 'Recession-Proof Graduate', whose work on working for free is praised by Tim Ferriss.
A rapper whose music Noah Kagan listens to for workout motivation.
Known for popularizing kettlebells in the US, his 'Easy Strength' protocols are recommended for strength, endurance, and flexibility, embodying minimum effective dose principles.
Nobel Prize-winning physicist, who worked on the atomic bomb, identified the Challenger disaster O-ring, and became an admired figure for his curiosity and indifference to public pressure, also a painter late in life.
Entrepreneur known for multiple successful ventures (PayPal, Tesla, SpaceX), whose YouTube videos Noah Kagan watches for learning and inspiration.
A mutual friend of Tim and Noah, who also sleeps in darkness and once chastised Noah for not eating enough.
Author of 'Ogilvy on Advertising', a key figure in the advertising industry.
A musician mentioned as a client of a leather pants maker from the 'Small Giants' book, highlighting a niche, high-quality business.
Subject of 'The Jinx' documentary, discussed for his shocking story and legal troubles.
Actor associated with the Casa Amigos tequila brand.
Co-founder of PayPal and first investor in Facebook, encountered serendipitously by Tim Ferriss in San Francisco. Known for focusing employees on a single measurable objective.
Friend of Tim Ferriss, early employee at Facebook (#30) and Mint.com (#4), co-founder of Sumo.com and AppSumo, and creator of multiple seven-figure products.
Podcast host who influenced Tim Ferriss to try flotation tanks.
Actor who starred in the movie adaptation of 'Jack Reacher'.
Author of 'The Martian', whose self-published journey to blockbuster success appealed to Tim Ferriss.
Author of 'Starting Strength' and 'Pragmatic Programming', known for his pragmatic approaches to training and programming.
Co-founder of Twitter, Blogger, and Medium, admired by Noah Kagan for his repeated business success and mission-driven approach beyond money, and observed by Tim as a surprisingly happy individual despite his achievements.
Founder of Mixergy, who introduced Tim Ferriss to ScheduleOnce due to his extensive interviewing experience.
Mythologist known for his work on the 'hero's journey' story arc, which Tim Ferriss uses to structure his book chapters to make them more memorable.
Actor who starred in 'Commando'.
Daughter of Chet Holmes, author of 'The Ultimate Sales Machine'.
One of Noah Kagan's best friends, who served as an accountability buddy during Noah's weight gain journey.
A content creator known for strict routines, particularly around sleep and waking times, relevant to Noah Kagan's changing sleep routines.
A parkour athlete and acrobat who competes on American Ninja Warrior and was Tim Ferriss's parkour teacher, whose Instagram is a source of motivation.
Former sales manager for AppSumo, known for her 'angry Asian mother formula' of daily morning and evening check-ins on three key tasks, emphasizing accountability and progress.
Author of 'Small Giants', a book about companies that prioritize quality and passion over sheer size.
Co-founder and CEO of Facebook, whose strategy of focusing on one primary goal (growth) influenced Noah Kagan's business philosophy.
A co-founder of Netscape, whose time management philosophy influenced Noah Kagan to leave calendar space open and focus on a few key priorities.
A book by Shane Snow, recommended by Noah Kagan as a really good book.
A book mentioned by Tim Ferriss as appearing on his bookshelf, implying its significance for his mindset.
A series of fiction books that Noah Kagan reads to help him fall asleep, as opposed to watching stimulating TV shows.
A highly recommended but often unread book on advertising by David Ogilvy, which Noah Kagan found very insightful.
A book that teaches the importance of saying 'no' to everything not important, deeply influencing Noah Kagan's business philosophy at Sumo.com to focus on a single revenue target.
A children's book that became a bestseller after being leaked as a PDF, cited as an example of viral publishing success.
An old-school book recommended for those starting a service or consulting business, offering advice on raising prices and getting started.
A book strong on sales, particularly around SaaS-based selling, covering topics like filtering people on LinkedIn and asking for referrals.
A thick, comprehensive book on hiring, from which 'Who' is a condensed version.
An 'epic' book by Charlie Hoehn, highly recommended for younger people starting out or anyone reinventing themselves.
A book mentioned by Tim Ferriss as being on his bookshelf, suggesting a theme of vibrant living and philosophical inquiry.
A book by Tim Ferriss that became a #1 New York Times and Wall Street Journal bestseller, where he recommended Athletic Greens, and whose content can be enhanced by the spin selling approach.
An amazing fiction book by Andy Weir, recommended by Noah Kagan as one of the best in recent years, also adapted into a movie.
A novel by William Golding, referenced by Noah Kagan to describe Austin's vibrant, youthful atmosphere.
A free copywriting resource, particularly the 'Boron letters' written to his son, highly recommended by Noah Kagan and Neville Medhora for learning how to sell and write fluidly.
A denser book by Mark Rippetoe focusing on medium-term and long-term training planning and cycling.
A free collection of letters written by Gary Halbert to his son while in jail, revered by Noah Kagan for their phenomenal copywriting lessons.
A popular book among engineers by Mark Rippetoe, offering pragmatic approaches to strength training, particularly focusing on five sets of five reps.
A book that shifted Noah Kagan's mindset on approaching customers by focusing on their problems and how a solution can improve their lives, using the situation-problem-implication-need-solution formula.
A book mentioned as an example of a viral sensation that became a bestseller after initially being turned down by publishers.
One of Noah Kagan's favorite books, by Nobel Prize winner Richard Feynman, admired for its author's curiosity, varied experiences, and independence from public opinion.
A condensed version of 'Topgrading', providing a framework for hiring, including questions to ask and how to filter candidates, used by the founder of Mint.com.
An 'underground' sales business book by Chet Holmes, highly recommended by Noah Kagan for its practical advice on selling.
A book by Bo Burlingham about companies that choose to be the best rather than the biggest, which resonated with Tim Ferriss and Noah Kagan as a refreshing perspective on entrepreneurial success.
A major US city in the Bay Area, compared to Austin in terms of tech density and a place where serendipitous encounters can happen due to higher population density.
A major US city, compared to Austin as being spread out, making serendipitous encounters harder.
A city in Texas where Noah Kagan resides, praised for its affordability, attractive lifestyle, abundant tacos, and growing tech scene, similar to the Bay Area 10 years prior.
Noah Kagan's birthplace, mentioned in humorous context of his ESL background.
A major US city, compared to Austin in terms of population density and entrepreneurial hustle. Noah recommends younger people stay in such cities.
A specific router model Noah Kagan upgraded to, highlighting the importance of investing in high-quality internet infrastructure for productivity.
A high-end blender that Noah Kagan owns but prefers not to use due to its extensive cleaning requirements compared to the Nutribullet.
A protein bar, mentioned as one of Noah Kagan's favorite protein bars.
Urine test strips to indicate ketosis, less precise than the Precision Xtra device.
A specific pillow brand that Noah Kagan finds really good for sleep optimization.
A tool made of two lacrosse balls melted together, used by Tim Ferriss to roll out his feet daily as part of reflexology.
A blender that is Noah Kagan's favorite purchase for under $100, valued for its ease of cleaning compared to larger blenders like Vitamix.
A device used by Tim Ferriss for precise tracking of ketone levels in millimolar, optimizing mental performance on a ketogenic diet.
A meal replacement drink, which Shane Snow experimented with and reviewed on Tim Ferriss's blog.
A Texas whiskey, called the 'number one whiskey in the world' by Noah Kagan.
A component Richard Feynman helped identify as the cause of the Challenger disaster.
A Wi-Fi or Bluetooth enabled smart scale used by Noah Kagan to automatically track and graph his weight, sharing the data with his accountability partner.
A more expensive tequila, recommended by Noah Kagan as the best for its price, known for its porcelain white bottle.
George Clooney's tequila brand, recommended by Noah Kagan as an affordable and delicious reposado tequila.
A nuclear weapon that Richard Feynman helped create while working at Los Alamos.
A hypothetical newsletter topic (ketogenic diet) that Noah Kagan uses to demonstrate how to build an email list quickly and for free, as an incentive for Tim Ferriss's listeners.
A hormone involved in appetite and metabolism regulation, mentioned in the context of biochemical reasons leaning out helps bulking.
A training program popularized by Pavel Tsatsouline, known for its simplicity and effectiveness in building strength and endurance with minimal effort.
A hypertrophy program from 'the online coach' focusing on heavy weights, five sets, and core movements, which Noah Kagan followed to get bigger and bulkier.
An all-in-one nutritional insurance supplement that Tim Ferriss recommends and uses for optimal performance, especially when traveling.
A compound that acts as an 'insulin mimetic,' helping to store calories in muscle tissue, mimicking the effects of insulin without the dangerous injection.
A compound involved in muscle mass, mentioned as a component in weight gainers that can lead to some temporary weight fluctuation.
A supplement Noah Kagan used to significantly help him gain weight and muscle mass, acknowledging it helps with mass but with some temporary effects due to creatine.
A national laboratory where Richard Feynman worked, designing the atomic bomb.
A major American newspaper, mentioned as a source of bestsellers including 'The 4-Hour Body'.
A prominent American business-focused newspaper, mentioned as a source of bestsellers including 'The 4-Hour Body'.
A rock band, mentioned as clients of a leather pants maker in 'Small Giants'.
An emo band, whose music Tim Ferriss listens to and admits he's sometimes embarrassed by.
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