How did Bozoma Saint John's parents influence her boldness and leadership?

Both of Bozoma's parents embodied boldness; her father ran for political office and her mother was direct and celebrated their cultural differences. This upbringing instilled in her a fearlessness and a natural inclination to pursue leadership roles, even after facing setbacks like losing student council elections twice.

How did Bozoma Saint John get her start in New York without a clear plan?

After her year-long sabbatical, Bozoma moved to New York with no job or money, staying on a friend's couch. She networked by being curious and friendly and received advice from a kind older lady at a Dominican spot who suggested a temp agency. This led to a temporary position at Spike Lee's advertising agency.

What was Bozoma Saint John's experience working for Spike Lee?

Bozoma began as an assistant at Spike Lee's advertising agency. After he asked her to read his 'Bamboozled' script, she marked it up extensively with corrections. Though initially angry, Lee praised her notes and offered her a permanent position, recognizing her potential.

Why did Bozoma Saint John leave Pepsi for a fashion company and what was the outcome?

Bozoma quit Pepsi as a brand manager due to feeling constrained by traditional roles and wanting more creative leadership. She joined Ashley Stewart, a fashion company for plus-size women, as head of marketing. Despite her marketing skills, a lack of experience in merchandising and large-team leadership led to her departure after about nine months.

How did Bozoma Saint John cope with the loss of her husband and transition to Beats Music?

Following the difficult diagnosis and passing of her husband Peter, Bozoma found solace and inspiration in work. She promised Peter to continue living life deeply. A meeting with Jimmy Iovine led her to leave New York and Pepsi to move to LA and build Beats Music, a risk she felt was a sign for her future.

What lessons did Bozoma Saint John learn about grief and self-forgiveness?

Bozoma's husband's passing, particularly after a period of separation, taught her the importance of appreciating love and forgiving herself for lost time. She realized that healing involves learning from mistakes, not just 'getting over' loss, and to never take precious relationships for granted again.

What is Bozoma Saint John's advice regarding 'pro and con lists'?

Bozoma Saint John advises against making pro and con lists because, in her experience, they often lead her to rationalize out of good ideas or into bad ones. She champions listening to one's 'spirit' or intuition, even when it lacks logical explanation, as her gut feelings have consistently proven correct over time.

Who are some of Bozoma Saint John's key mentors?

Bozoma Saint John considers her parents as early role models and Spike Lee as an important mentor who inspired her boldness and disregard for critics. More recently, she has been inspired by figures like Kris Jenner, Oprah Winfrey, and Arianna Huffington, from whom she learned the profound importance of being present in interactions.

What was Bozoma Saint John's motivation for joining Uber as Chief Brand Officer?

Bozoma joined Uber not to 'save the brand,' but to 'save an ideal.' She felt a deep need to contribute to solutions for sexual harassment, diversity, and discrimination issues within the industry. She saw it as a catalyst to push for better community, society, and work environments, ensuring progress rather than regression.

How can individuals contribute to positive change instead of just complaining?

Bozoma emphasizes that everyone has the power to effect change. Instead of just complaining, she encourages active participation: recommending diverse candidates, implementing inclusive procedures as a leader, and celebrating good things to encourage more positive actions. This collective positive reinforcement can outweigh negativity.

Key Moments

Bozoma Saint John Interview | The Tim Ferriss Show (Podcast)

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Key Moments

TL;DR

Bozoma Saint John on resilience, career risks, grief, and leading with bold authenticity.

Key Insights

Embrace transformation and 'burning oneself in their own flame' to rise anew, drawing strength from past challenges.

Boldness and leadership are often cultivated through family influence and a mindset that views setbacks as opportunities for growth.

Authenticity is key; don't be afraid to be different and celebrate those distinctions, as it's a source of strength.

Taking calculated risks, even when underqualified, can lead to unexpected career opportunities and profound learning experiences.

Grief can be a profound teacher, leading to self-forgiveness and a deeper appreciation for love and life's precious moments.

Cultivate presence and empathy in interactions; how you make others feel is as important as what you say or do.

THE PHOENIX PSYCHOLOGY: RISING FROM THE ASHES

Bozoma Saint John's life is deeply shaped by the metaphor of the phoenix. Her pinned tweet on Nietzsche's quote, 'You must be ready to burn yourself in your own flame; how could you rise anew if you have not first become ashes?', encapsulates her philosophy. This stems from significant early life events, including a coup d'état in Ghana at age five, which forced her family to flee to the U.S. for political asylum. These experiences, though traumatic, instilled in her a resilience and an ability to view upheaval not as an end, but as a catalyst for a better beginning.

CULTIVATING BOLDNESS AND AUTHENTICITY

Originating from a family of bold individuals, Bozoma credits her parents' active and decisive lives as foundational. Her father's political involvement and her mother's unwavering commitment to cultural authenticity — for instance, refusing to make pizzas for guests and insisting on serving traditional dishes — instilled a strong sense of self. This upbringing fostered a fearlessness in pursuing leadership roles from a young age, like captaining cheerleading squads and running for student council, teaching her the value of trying, even if initial attempts don't yield victory.

THE ART OF THE PITCH AND CAREER CATALYSTS

Saint John's career trajectory is marked by an ability to seize opportunities, often by taking initiative and demonstrating potential beyond her formal qualifications. A pivotal moment occurred when she, an assistant answering phones at Spike Lee's advertising agency, provided extensive notes on his script for 'Bamboozled.' This bold move, though initially met with surprise, ultimately led to her permanent position. This experience reinforced her belief, echoed by entrepreneur Daymond John, that qualification isn't always a prerequisite for advancement; initiative often is.

NAVIGATING FAILURE AND UNEXPECTED TURNS

Her career path includes instances of apparent failure that proved to be crucial learning experiences. A brief stint in pharmaceutical advertising, chosen for its perceived difficulty, taught her she could handle challenging fields but also clarified her passion for consumer engagement and pop culture marketing. Similarly, her leadership role at Ashley Stewart, a fashion company, proved challenging due to her lack of specific industry knowledge, highlighting the importance of understanding the core business alongside marketing expertise. These 'failed' experiments ultimately refined her focus.

LOVE, LOSS, AND THE LESSONS OF GRIEF

The death of her husband, Peter, after a battle with cancer, was a profound turning point. They had separated before his diagnosis, making his passing a catalyst for deep self-forgiveness regarding lost time and unspoken words. This experience solidified not only her appreciation for profound love but also the critical importance of cherishing each day. Her grief transformed into a commitment to live life with 'fire,' to not take love for granted, and to actively learn from past regrets, a lesson she now applies to all her endeavors.

TRUSTING INTUITION AND SPEAKING YOUR TRUTH

Saint John advocates for trusting one's 'spirit' or inner voice over pro-and-con lists, which she believes often lead people to talk themselves out of good ideas or into bad ones. This approach, exemplified by her decision to move across the country for a role at Uber shortly after her husband's death, is about radical self-trust. She also recounts receiving damaging advice early in her career to avoid red lipstick, a suggestion she found detrimental as it sought to quiet her natural boldness. This experience reinforced her belief in creating her own rules and showing up authentically.

LEADERSHIP AS PROBLEM-SOLVING AND ADVOCACY

Her move to Uber as Chief Brand Officer was driven by a desire to contribute to solutions for critical issues like sexual harassment, diversity, and discrimination within the industry. She views her role not as simply saving a brand, but as safeguarding ideals and ensuring progress. This proactive stance empowers individuals to be agents of change, emphasizing that active participation and building positive environments are more effective than mere complaints. She advocates for celebrating successes and offering encouragement to foster further positive developments.

MASTERING PRESENCE AND EMPATHIC CONNECTION

Drawing inspiration from figures like Arianna Huffington, Saint John highlights the power of presence in leadership and relationships. Being fully attentive in conversations, maintaining eye contact, and responding thoughtfully makes others feel valued and cared for. This quality, she notes, creates a stronger connection and fosters trust, reminding her of Maya Angelou's words that people remember how you made them feel. This practice of intentional engagement is a key element of her assertive approach to life and work.

Mentioned in This Episode

●Software & Apps

●Companies

●Organizations

●Books

●Concepts

●People Referenced

Common Questions

Bozoma Saint John deeply aligns with the 'Phoenix rising from ash' concept, stemming from dramatic life events like her family's political asylum from Ghana. She believes challenging experiences lead to better new beginnings, fostering a fearlessness towards change and conflict.

Topics

Leadership Mindset & Self-Improvement Business & Entrepreneurship Relationships & Communication Career Development Personal Growth Grief And Loss Diversity And Inclusion Brand Marketing

Mentioned in this video

People

Bozoma Saint John

The guest of the podcast, who has served as Chief Brand Officer at Uber, and previously as a marketing executive at Apple Music and head of global marketing for Beats Music.

Maya Angelou

An American poet and civil rights activist quoted by Bozoma Saint John regarding how people remember how you made them feel, not just what you said.

Tupac Shakur

The subject of a class Bozoma Saint John taught in her senior year of college.

Jimmy Iovine

Co-founder of Beats Electronics and Beats Music, who hired Bozoma Saint John as Head of Marketing for Beats Music.

Jon Favreau

A mutual friend of Tim Ferriss and Bozoma Saint John, mentioned for his entrepreneurial and investing success, and for his quote on doing what you're not qualified for.

Toni Morrison

An author beloved by Bozoma Saint John, known for her rich storytelling and challenging prose.

Friedrich Nietzsche

A German philosopher from whom Bozoma Saint John's pinned tweet, about burning oneself to rise anew, is quoted.

Kevin Rose

A friend of Tim Ferriss who influenced him to try Peloton, noting his improved physique and consistent usage.

Spike Lee

Film director who hired Bozoma Saint John after she temped in his advertising agency and provided critical notes on his 'Bamboozled' script.

Matt Wilpers

A Peloton instructor whose 20-minute high-intensity training sessions Tim enjoys.

Oprah Winfrey

A media executive and philanthropist who has inspired Bozoma Saint John, and whom she has recently had the opportunity to know.

Arianna Huffington

Co-founder of The Huffington Post and founder/CEO of Thrive Global, who has had a significant impact on Bozoma Saint John's life, especially regarding the importance of presence.

Kris Jenner

A public figure who has inspired Bozoma Saint John with her bold approach.

Travis Kalanick

Former CEO of Uber, whom Bozoma Saint John met to discuss joining the company.

Joseph Gordon-Levitt

An actor mentioned by Tim Ferriss for his insight about stating what you're 'for' rather than just what you're 'against.'

Organizations

Billboard

A notable music industry publication that named Bozoma Saint John 'Executive of the Year' in 2016.

Wesleyan University

The college Bozoma Saint John attended, where she was pre-med and also involved in social clubs and events, including bringing Jay-Z to campus.

New York Times

A major newspaper that reported on Bozoma Saint John's decision to take a year-long sabbatical before attending medical school.

Fortune

A business magazine that included Bozoma Saint John in its '40 Under 40' list.

Companies

Fast Company

A business magazine that included Bozoma Saint John on its '100 Most Creative People' list.

Peloton

An indoor cycling bike and streaming platform for live and on-demand fitness classes. Tim endorses it as an integral part of his week.

Uber

The company where Bozoma Saint John became Chief Brand Officer in 2017.

Helix Sleep

A mattress company offering personalized mattresses based on sleeping preferences and body type, with a 100-night trial.

Pepsi

A beverage company where Bozoma Saint John worked as a brand manager and later returned to lead the music entertainment group, making deals across entertainment types.

Beats Electronics

The company known for headphones and speakers, already a booming business when Beats Music was launched.

Ashley Stewart

A fashion company that Bozoma Saint John joined as Head of Marketing, targeting plus-size women of color, where she learned valuable leadership and business lessons despite a short tenure.

DDB Worldwide

An advertising agency on Madison Avenue where Bozoma Saint John and her late husband Peter worked.

Media

Mad Men

A TV series about advertising agencies in New York, with DDB being an agency it was supposedly based on.

Bamboozled

A film script Spike Lee gave to Bozoma Saint John for feedback when she was working as his assistant.

Software & Apps

Beats Music

A music streaming platform, the first of its kind under Jimmy Iovine, where Bozoma Saint John was Head of Global Marketing before its acquisition by Apple.

Apple Music

The music streaming service where Bozoma Saint John was a marketing executive after Apple acquired Beats Music.

Concepts

Fante language

A dialect spoken in Ghana, which Bozoma Saint John's mother insisted they speak at home, reinforcing cultural identity.

Books

Song of Solomon

A novel by Toni Morrison that had a significant impact on Bozoma Saint John's life and became a touching personal story in her relationship with her late husband, Peter.

Meditations by Marcus Aurelius

A book mentioned as one of Arianna Huffington's favorites, which speaks to cultivating emotional resilience.

The Defiant Ones

A miniseries about Dr. Dre and Jimmy Iovine, highly recommended by Tim Ferriss.