What is the current controversy surrounding Turkesterone supplements?

Recent independent testing of popular Turkesterone products has revealed that many are significantly underdosed, often containing only a fraction of the labeled amount, or even negligible amounts. Some products appear to contain more Beta-Ecdysterone instead.

What are the most commonly neglected muscle groups in typical gym routines?

According to a Stronger By Science article, commonly neglected muscles include those involved in scapular protraction (like the pec minor and serratus anterior), the hip flexor group, and the hip adductor group.

Can training neglected muscles like the pec minor or hip flexors improve physique?

Yes, developing deep muscles like the pec minor or hip flexors can push larger muscles outwards or fill anatomical spaces, leading to a more developed and visually impressive physique, similar to how training the brachialis enhances bicep size.

Is carbohydrate overfeeding during bulking a 'cheat code' for gaining muscle without fat?

No, carbohydrate overfeeding is not a cheat code. While direct conversion of carbs to fat (de novo lipogenesis) is inefficient and less likely when dietary fat is present, excess calories will still be stored. The thermic effect of carbs and their storage as glycogen play roles, but thermodynamics still apply.

Under what conditions does de novo lipogenesis from carbohydrates occur?

De novo lipogenesis from carbohydrates primarily occurs in scenarios of extreme carbohydrate overfeeding combined with severe fat restriction. In typical diets, even low-fat ones, excess fat calories are usually stored before significant de novo lipogenesis takes place.

Does a high-carb, low-fat diet lead to less fat gain during bulking?

While high-carb, low-fat diets can be slightly less efficient for fat storage due to the energy cost of converting carbs to fat, this difference is usually minor and most relevant during extreme caloric surpluses. Finding a correct calorie surplus and effective training is more critical.

What is the controversial claim about running and men's health?

A headline suggested running ages men biologically, stemming from research showing older male runners had stiffer aortas compared to their chronological age. However, this interpretation is debated and potentially misleading.

What does the broader scientific literature say about running and men's health?

Despite the headline, extensive research indicates running is associated with lower cardiovascular mortality, reduced stroke risk, and lower blood pressure in men, contradicting the idea that it significantly 'ages' them vascularly.

Are there music recommendations suitable for heavy training sessions?

Yes, the podcast recommends bands like Tool and Mastodon, known for their complex, well-musicianship, and heavier rock sound that can be compatible with resistance training.

Turkesterone, Carb Overfeeding, and Commonly Neglected Muscles (Ep 92)

Stronger By Science

Sports4 min read82 min video

Jun 23, 2022|7,373 views|290|41

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Key Moments

TL;DR

Discusses supplement controversies (Turkesterone), neglected muscles, and carbohydrate overfeeding.

Key Insights

Turkesterone and beta-ecdysterone supplements may be aggressively underdosed or contain inaccurate ingredients.

Neglected muscle groups include scapular protractors, hip flexors, and hip ad/abductors, which contribute significantly to overall muscle mass and can impact physique.

Carbohydrate overfeeding is not a 'cheat code' for bulking; while de novo lipogenesis is less efficient than fat storage, it can occur, especially with extreme carb intake and fat restriction.

The article 'The Most Commonly Neglected Movements and Muscles' by Cameron Gill offers insights into training overlooked muscle groups.

Science by press release can lead to misinterpretations, as seen with a news article suggesting running ages men, contradicting broader research.

While de novo lipogenesis from carbs is inefficient, it offers a slight buffer against overeating during bulking compared to fat.

ATHLETIC ACHIEVEMENTS AND PODCAST CORRECTIONS

The episode opens with a recap of recent powerlifting competitions, highlighting impressive records in squats, bench presses, deadlifts, and total lifts across various weight classes by athletes like Jonathan Garcia, Russell Ori, Jamar Royster, Elias Buchalam, Aseam Inohoro, Eddie Berglund, Bryce Lewis, and David Wilson. The hosts also address 'Wronger By Science' corrections from the previous episode regarding the phrenic nerve and a humorous acknowledgment of a Mitch Hedberg joke reference.

PHYTOECDYSTEROID SUPPLEMENT CONTROVERSY

The discussion delves into the controversy surrounding phytoecdysteroid supplements like beta-ecdysterone and turkesterone. Historically, beta-ecdysterone hype fizzled due to limited human data and findings of severe underdosing in supplements. Turkesterone has faced similar hype, but recent independent testing suggests many products contain negligible amounts of the active ingredient, often containing more beta-ecdysterone instead, raising questions about market quality and supplier integrity.

IDENTIFYING AND TARGETING NEGLECTED MUSCLES

An article by Cameron Gill, 'The Most Commonly Neglected Movements and Muscles,' is highlighted. It identifies neglected muscle groups as scapular protractors (pec minor, serratus anterior), the hip flexor group, and hip ad/abductors. These groups represent significant muscle volume, comparable to major muscles like the lats or glutes, and their development can contribute to overall physique and potentially aid in long-term training longevity by addressing imbalances.

VISUAL IMPACT OF TRAINING NEGLECTED MUSCLES

The visual impact of training neglected muscles is compared to developing the brachialis, which pushes the bicep further from the humerus, making the arm appear larger. Similarly, improved hip flexor development can make quads appear more developed, and enhanced pec minor development can contribute to better upper chest aesthetics. These deeper or less superficial muscles contribute to a more complete and developed physique when trained effectively.

CARBOHYDRATE OVERFEEDING DURING BULKING

The podcast addresses carbohydrate overfeeding during bulking, debunking the idea that it's a 'cheat code.' While direct conversion of excess carbs to fat (de novo lipogenesis) is inefficient and less likely when fat is also consumed, it can occur under conditions of extreme carb overfeeding and severe fat restriction. The primary fates of excess carbs include glycogen storage and oxidation for energy, with some energy expenditure due to the thermic effect of feeding.

NUANCES OF DE NOVO LIPOGENESIS AND BULKING STRATEGIES

The inefficiency of de novo lipogenesis from carbohydrates is highlighted; while it leads to some energy wastage, making high-carb overfeeding slightly less conducive to fat gain than high-fat overfeeding at equivalent calories, this difference is marginal in practical terms. The article emphasizes that during bulking, focusing on sufficient protein intake, effective hypertrophy training, and an appropriate calorie surplus is paramount, rather than over-manipulating macronutrient ratios for perceived metabolic advantages. A controversial abstract suggesting muscle gain and fat loss on extreme low-fat diets is discussed but largely dismissed due to lack of replication and potential methodological flaws.

SCIENCE BY PRESS RELEASE AND MEDIA MISREPRESENTATION

The segment on 'Science by Press Release' criticizes how preliminary research findings are often sensationalized and misrepresented in media. An example is given where a press release about a study showing stiffer aortas in male runners compared to female runners, presented at a conference, led to headlines claiming running ages men. This bypasses crucial context, such as the overall benefits of running for cardiovascular health, reduced mortality, and lower blood pressure, which contradict the sensationalized narrative.

THE IMPLICATIONS OF RUNNING RESEARCH

The research discussed suggests that while male runners might exhibit increased aortic stiffness, this does not translate to negative health outcomes. Extensive meta-analyses show that running is associated with lower all-cause, cardiovascular, and cancer mortality, reduced stroke risk, and lower blood pressure in both men and women. This highlights the danger of drawing definitive conclusions from preliminary findings and the need for journalistic integrity and background research to avoid public misinformation.

MUSICAL RECOMMENDATIONS FOR TRAINING

Concluding the episode, the hosts offer musical recommendations for training, shifting from their usual eclectic tastes to heavier genres. Tool and Mastodon are suggested for their complexity, musicianship, and slightly more conventional compatibility with resistance training. The effectiveness of aggressive music for catharsis and stress release is noted, contrasting personal experiences with intense concert environments.

Mentioned in This Episode

●Supplements

●Software & Apps

●Organizations

●Concepts

●People Referenced

Addressing Neglected Muscles

Practical takeaways from this episode

Do This

Incorporate exercises that target scapular protractors (pec minor, serratus anterior) for better upper chest development.

Include training for hip flexors, as their total muscle volume can exceed that of the gluteus maximus.

Pay attention to the hip adductor group, which is often neglected.

Consider training deep muscles like the brachialis, which can enhance the visual size of the biceps.

Be aware that developing these often-neglected muscles can contribute to overall aesthetic development and potentially improve movement longevity.

Avoid This

Do not solely focus on major compound lifts (squats, presses, hinges) as they may neglect certain muscle groups.

Avoid assuming that visible muscles are the only ones that matter for physique or function.

Do not ignore persistent hip or back discomfort; neglected musculature might be a contributing factor.

Common Questions

Phytoecdysteroids are compounds produced by plants as defense mechanisms. They've gained popularity in fitness due to research suggesting Turkesterone, in particular, may have anabolic effects, although robust human data is limited.

Topics

Phytoecdysteroids Turkesterone Beta-Ecdysterone Supplement Industry Neglected Muscles Hip Flexors Serratus Anterior Pec Minor Carbohydrate Overfeeding De Novo Lipogenesis

Mentioned in this video

personJonathan Garcia

Set a new squat record in the 66 kg weight class.

personElias Bouchalala

Benched 291.5 kg at super heavyweight at IPF Worlds, improving his record.

supplementTurkesterone

A phytoecdysteroid currently popular in the fitness world, driven by mechanistic and rodent data suggesting anabolic potential. However, independent testing suggests many products are significantly underdosed or contain little to no Turkesterone.

conceptBrachialis

A deep muscle in the upper arm that, when developed, pushes the bicep outwards, making the entire arm appear larger.

conceptHip Flexors

A group of muscles in the anterior thigh that can be neglected if not specifically trained, impacting overall leg development.

conceptHip Adductor Group

A muscle group that can be neglected in conventional gym exercises.

organizationCardiac Risk in the Young

Funder of the research presented at the British Cardiovascular Society conference regarding exercise and arterial stiffness.

mediaLamb of God

A band that toured with Mastodon and Behemoth in 2006.

conceptDe Novo Lipogenesis

The metabolic process of converting excess carbohydrates into fat for storage. It is generally inefficient and rarely the primary pathway when fat is also consumed.

mediaTool

A band whose music is recommended for training, known for complexity and musicianship.

personAcean Inohoro

Pulled 362.5 kg in the 83 kg class at IPF Worlds, noted for being a junior.

personDavid Wilson

Totaled 900 kg at 110 kg and was close to winning his weight class, making a gutsy deadlift attempt.

personBill Hicks

Comedian whose joke structure was mistakenly referenced.

personJesse Norris

Mentioned as holding the record for the second biggest squat in the 90kg class.

supplementBeta-Ecdysterone

A phytoecdysteroid that was previously popular in the fitness world but lost favor due to underwhelming human research and potential underdosing issues in products.

personRussell Ory

Achieved a new squat record in the 82.5 kg class at USAPL Mega Nationals and set a new total record in the changed weight classes.

personEddie Berglund

Set a record total of 710 kg in the 66 kg weight class.

conceptSerratus Anterior

A scapular protractor muscle that is a large muscle group and often neglected, contributing significantly to total muscle volume in the shoulder girdle.

personJamar Royster

A Macro Factor athlete who achieved a significant squat in the 90kg weight class.

personGreg Nicols

Permanent guest co-host of the Stronger By Science podcast.

conceptPec Minor

A scapular protractor muscle group that is often neglected and lies deep to the pectoralis muscles, contributing to upper chest development.

mediaBehemoth

A band that toured with Lamb of God and Mastodon in 2006.

conceptPhytoecdysteroids

Plant-derived compounds that function as hormones in insects, causing molting and death. Recently popular in the fitness world.

personMendez Neto

Lead author of a 2011 conference abstract about high-carb, low-fat overfeeding that has been difficult to find and replicate.