Key Moments
Diego Saez Gil - How Pachama Uses Tech to Solve Climate Change
Y CombinatorKey Moments
Pachama uses AI and remote sensing to verify carbon credits from forest conservation and restoration projects.
Key Insights
Pachama leverages AI and remote sensing (satellite imagery, lidar) to accurately verify and monitor carbon capture in forests, overcoming traditional certification inefficiencies.
The carbon market is growing rapidly, but historically, forest conservation and restoration projects receive less than 2% of funding; Pachama aims to bridge this gap.
Pachama acts as a marketplace, connecting companies seeking to offset carbon emissions directly with verified forest projects, enhancing transparency and trust.
Forests offer significant potential for carbon drawdown, with an estimated 1 billion hectares available for restoration capable of capturing hundreds of gigatons of carbon.
Beyond carbon, Pachama highlights the co-benefits of forest projects, including biodiversity, water conservation, and community impacts, which buyers can consider.
Technological advancements, particularly in AI and data collection (like NASA's Jedi lidar program), are crucial for scaling Pachama's global verification capabilities.
THE OPPORTUNITY: CLIMATE CHANGE AND THE POTENTIAL OF FORESTS
The conversation opens by acknowledging climate change as a critical global challenge, and Diego Saez Gil, founder of Pachama, highlights the immense, yet underutilized, potential of forests in mitigating it. He notes that reforestation and forest conservation are among the most significant solutions available. A study suggests that over 1 billion hectares globally could be restored to forests without competing with agriculture, offering the potential to sequester hundreds of gigatons of carbon, a substantial fraction of historical emissions. This underscores the scale of the opportunity and the urgency for effective action.
THE PROBLEM: INEFFICIENCIES AND LACK OF TRUST IN CARBON MARKETS
Despite the potential, significant barriers exist within the carbon market. Certifying forest projects traditionally takes years and costs hundreds of thousands of dollars due to manual auditing processes. This inefficiency limits the number of projects that can be verified. Furthermore, buyers often lack trust due to a history of opacity, potential fraud, and difficulties in tracking project progress and impact. This lack of transparency and credibility discourages investment in a crucial area of climate solutions.
PACHAMA'S TECHNOLOGICAL SOLUTION: AI AND REMOTE SENSING
Pachama addresses these issues by employing cutting-edge technology, primarily artificial intelligence and remote sensing. Using satellite imagery, lidar data, and machine learning algorithms, Pachama can accurately estimate a forest's existing carbon storage and its future carbon capture potential. This data-driven approach significantly speeds up the verification process, increases accuracy, and provides continuous monitoring, thereby enhancing the credibility and efficiency of forest carbon projects.
BUILDING TRUST THROUGH TRANSPARENCY AND A DIRECT MARKETPLACE
Pachama's platform aims to build trust by offering unprecedented transparency. Users can view project locations, see regularly updated satellite imagery, access project descriptions, and understand the co-benefits, such as biodiversity and water conservation. By creating a direct marketplace, Pachama also removes intermediaries (brokers, traders) between forest projects and carbon credit buyers. This direct connection ensures that capital flows more efficiently and transparently to verified nature-based solutions.
THE ECONOMIC INCENTIVE AND GROWING DEMAND FOR CARBON CREDITS
The economic incentive for forest projects is driven by the growing carbon market, valued at over $80 billion annually. While historically underfunded, forest conservation is poised to receive more attention, especially with upcoming regulations like the CORSIA framework for airlines mandating carbon offsetting. Pachama seeks to facilitate this capital flow, making it easier for companies to offset their emissions through credible forest projects, aligning economic interests with environmental goals.
BEYOND CARBON: HOLISTIC BENEFITS AND FUTURE POTENTIAL
Pachama emphasizes that forest projects offer more than just carbon sequestration. They are vital for biodiversity, wildlife habitats, water conservation, and generating local employment. Buyers can choose projects based on these co-benefits, making a more holistic impact. Looking ahead, Pachama envisions expanding its platform to encompass other nature-based solutions like blue carbon (mangroves, kelp forests) and regenerative agriculture, aiming to be a central hub for understanding and financing the planet's ecosystems.
TECHNOLOGICAL CHALLENGES AND DATA COLLECTION EFFORTS
The primary technical challenge lies in data acquisition and quality. Pachama collaborates with major satellite providers and leverages existing lidar data, but is actively seeking more ground-truth data for model training. Excitement surrounds NASA's upcoming Jedi lidar data release, which could enable global coverage. While data availability varies by region, Pachama is actively working to obtain valuable datasets from forest services and research institutions worldwide.
SCALING UP AND THE ROLE OF ENTREPRENEURSHIP IN CLIMATE TECH
The company, though less than a year old, has onboarded over ten forest projects and secured ten customers, with interest from major corporations. Diego Saez Gil encourages individuals with technical skills to consider founding their own climate tech companies or joining existing startups. He stresses that while the mission is crucial, a scalable business model and technological defensibility are essential for long-term success, drawing parallels to traditional Silicon Valley startup principles.
THE FUTURE OF CARBON MARKETS AND POLICY'S ROLE
The future of carbon markets will likely involve a combination of regulated compliance markets and a growing voluntary market driven by corporate and consumer demand. Saez Gil anticipates increased regulation, advocating for policies that hold major emitters accountable. He believes that while free markets are powerful, regulation is necessary to guide society toward desired outcomes, much like historical examples of successful regulatory interventions. This dual approach is seen as key to accelerating climate action.
Mentioned in This Episode
●Software & Apps
●Tools
●Companies
●Organizations
●Concepts
●People Referenced
Pachama's Approach to Climate Solutions
Practical takeaways from this episode
Do This
Avoid This
Carbon Project Types and Descriptions
Data extracted from this episode
| Project Type | Description | Key Considerations |
|---|---|---|
| Forest Conservation | Commitment to not cut down existing standing forests. | Crucial for protecting areas like the Amazon rainforest from deforestation due to economic pressures (cattle, agriculture). |
| Improved Forest Management | Sustainable harvesting of timber with practices like replanting and enriching the forest over decades. | Optimizes for both carbon capture and timber production; common in North America. |
| Reforestation | Planting trees in areas where forests previously existed. | Aims to restore forest cover to degraded lands. |
| Afforestation | Planting trees in areas where forests have not historically existed. | Technically more difficult, requiring soil preparation; less common due to available restoration land. |
Carbon Offset Market Size and Forest Project Share
Data extracted from this episode
| Metric | Value | Source/Note |
|---|---|---|
| Total Carbon Market Funding (Last Year) | $80 Billion+ | World Bank |
| Funding to Forest Conservation/Restoration | < 2% | Indicates a significant gap in funding distribution |
Estimated Carbon Emissions and Offset Costs for Service Companies
Data extracted from this episode
| Metric | Value | Notes |
|---|---|---|
| Annual Emissions per Employee | Approx. 6 tons CO2e | Mainly from electricity consumption and employee travel |
| Cost of Carbon Credits per Ton | $5 - $20 | Market price range |
| Annual Offset Cost per Employee | $50 - $150 | Combined estimate based on emissions and credit price |
Potential Carbon Drawdown from Forest Restoration
Data extracted from this episode
| Resource | Potential | Notes |
|---|---|---|
| Land Available for Restoration | 1 Billion hectares | Without competing with agriculture |
| Trees to Plant | 1 Trillion trees | On the available restoration land |
| Carbon Drawdown Potential | 200 Giga tons (of Carbon) | Equivalent to ~2/3 of total human emissions since the Industrial Revolution |
Common Questions
Pachama uses advanced technology like satellite imagery, lidar, and artificial intelligence to verify and monitor carbon sequestration in forests. This increases transparency and efficiency in the carbon market, connecting companies wanting to offset emissions with trustworthy forest conservation and restoration projects.
Topics
Mentioned in this video
A startup accelerator program that Diego Saez Gil has participated in with multiple companies. They also released a 'request for startup' focused on carbon removal.
The founder of Pachama, with a background in founding mobile app and smart luggage companies before pivoting to climate tech.
Diego Saez Gil's second company, which created trackable suitcases. It was accepted into Y Combinator.
Created the mechanism of carbon markets to incentivize climate change solutions like reforestation and conservation.
Where NASA's GEDAI lidar instrument is collecting data on forests around the planet.
Mentioned in the context of Samsung phones catching fire, which led to airlines banning lithium-ion batteries in luggage, impacting BlueSmart.
A deep learning technique used by Pachama to analyze lidar data and predict carbon storage in forests.
An airline that offers customers the option to offset their flights, showing a trend towards carbon offsetting in the travel industry.
Co-founder of Uber and Pachama's lead investor, bringing experience in building global marketplaces.
A venture capital firm that provided small checks to Pachama.
Identified as a major tech company with a climate change focus, suitable for professionals seeking to contribute to climate solutions.
Mentioned as a location with ancient rainforests that continue to capture carbon.
The company that acquired Diego Saez Gil's first startup, a mobile app for booking hostels and bed-and-breakfasts.
The agreement is mentioned as a catalyst for the growth of carbon markets and the increasing demand for carbon offsets.
Has a program called GEDAI that sends lidar to the International Space Station to collect forest data, which Pachama is eager to utilize.
An airline that offers customers the option to offset their flights, demonstrating early adoption of carbon offsetting initiatives.
Mentioned as a large tech company with a focus on climate change, offering potential opportunities for employment in the climate sector.
Diego Saez Gil and his co-founder moved to Hong Kong after Y Combinator to open an office for their smart luggage company.
A remote sensing technology used by Pachama to collect data points and estimate biomass and carbon content in forests.
An investment firm that invested in Pachama.
A venture capital firm that provided small checks to Pachama.
Mentioned through its co-founder Ryan Graves, who is Pachama's lead investor.
Referenced in the context of Buckminster Fuller's idea of an operating manual for Spaceship Earth, which aligns with Pachama's vision of a data platform for understanding planetary ecosystems.
Mentioned as a location with ancient rainforests that continue to capture carbon.
Diego Saez Gil grew up near the Amazon-type rainforest in northern Argentina and later visited the Amazon, where he was inspired by nature but heartbroken by deforestation.
Cited for data indicating that over $80 billion went into carbon market initiatives last year, with less than 2% going to forest conservation and restoration.
An investor in Pachama, known for early investment in Uber.
An investment firm that invested in Pachama.
A large tech company that has a stated focus on climate change, suggesting potential career paths for individuals looking to work in the climate sector within big corporations.
Conceptualized the idea of an 'operating manual for Spaceship Earth', which inspires Pachama's vision for a comprehensive data platform on ecosystems.
A sustainable agricultural practice that has the potential to produce high yields and obtain carbon credits.
An entity that shares data with Pachama, contributing to their data collection efforts for forest analysis.
An international framework that will require airlines to offset their emissions starting in 2021, creating significant demand for carbon offsets.
A method of agriculture that integrates trees with crops, considered a regenerative practice crucial for feeding a growing global population and potentially earning carbon credits.
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