How does the IRC differ from other humanitarian organizations like the UN or Doctors Without Borders?

The IRC is independent and not a government agency. It specifically focuses on people affected by conflict and disaster, works across the 'arc of crisis,' is both an international humanitarian aid agency and a U.S.-focused resettlement agency, emphasizes research and evidence-based programs, and hires 95% of its staff locally.

What is the scale of the global refugee and displacement crisis?

Currently, over 80 million people are forcibly displaced worldwide. This includes approximately 45 million internally displaced within their own countries and around 30 million refugees who have crossed international borders.

How can we distinguish between genuine refugees and economic migrants?

The 1951 Refugee Convention defines a refugee as someone with a well-founded fear of persecution. Systems exist to assess individual cases based on safety of return, with examples like Germany assessing asylum claims to differentiate.

What are the key challenges in addressing global conflicts and promoting peace?

Addressing global conflicts requires a clear vision for political settlement, willingness to use leverage (economic or diplomatic, not just military), and consideration of regional dynamics. Modern civil wars present a crisis of diplomacy and an 'age of impunity' where international norms are violated.

Is focusing on international issues practical when domestic problems like infrastructure are neglected?

Addressing international issues does not preclude fixing domestic problems. Foreign aid accounts for a tiny fraction of national income (0.17% in the U.S.), and global engagement is crucial for interdependence, innovation, and security, as retreat can create vacuums for rivals.

Should nations collaborate with governments that have poor human rights records?

Collaboration should not involve supporting human rights repression. It's essential to defend and speak up for one's own values, even when dealing with autocratic regimes. Ultimatums should be used cautiously, and choosing grounds for engagement is critical.

What are the biggest myths about refugees?

Major myths include that most refugees are in rich countries (86% are in poorer ones), that they mainly live in camps (60% are in urban areas), and that they typically return home quickly (less than 3% did last year).

Key Moments

A Conversation with David Miliband (Episode #215)

Sam Harris

Science & Technology4 min read49 min video

Aug 21, 2020|42,427 views|449|273

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Key Moments

TL;DR

David Miliband discusses global humanitarian crises, refugee challenges, and the evolving role of diplomacy and international aid.

Key Insights

The International Rescue Committee (IRC) focuses on individuals affected by conflict and disaster, providing aid and resettlement.

A significant global crisis exists with over 80 million forcibly displaced people, primarily in low-income countries.

Effective refugee policies require clear definitions, proper vetting, and border control, which can be managed systemically.

Diplomacy must be supported by leverage (economic or political) and consider regional dynamics, not just individual nations.

The "withdrawal doctrine" is a flawed approach; global engagement is crucial for national security and prosperity.

Addressing global challenges like pandemics and climate change requires international collaboration and cannot be solved by individual nations.

THE INTERNATIONAL RESCUE COMMITTEE'S MISSION

David Miliband, President and CEO of the International Rescue Committee (IRC), details the organization's origins tracing back to Albert Einstein's efforts to aid Jewish refugees in the 1930s. Today, the IRC operates globally, assisting individuals displaced by conflict and disaster, while also being the largest refugee resettlement agency in the U.S. Miliband highlights the IRC's distinct focus on those shattered by crisis, its dual role as a humanitarian aid provider and a resettlement agency, and its commitment to research and evidence-based programs, employing a significant number of local staff.

THE SCALE AND COMPLEXITY OF THE GLOBAL REFUGEE CRISIS

The discussion emphasizes the immense scale of forced displacement, with over 80 million people uprooted from their homes due to conflict and violence. Miliband distinguishes between internally displaced persons (IDPs) within their own countries and refugees who cross international borders. He notes that the vast majority, 86%, of refugees are hosted in poor or lower-middle-income countries, challenging the myth that most refugees are in wealthier nations. Most refugees also live in urban areas, not camps, and face prolonged displacement due to ongoing conflicts.

NAVIGATING THE ETHICS AND POLITICS OF REFUGEE ADMISSION

The conversation addresses the complex debate surrounding refugee admission, acknowledging legitimate concerns about distinguishing refugees from economic migrants, security vetting, and border control. Miliband argues that well-established systems, like the 1951 Refugee Convention, provide frameworks for assessing claims. He stresses the importance of effective vetting processes, which are rigorous for refugees entering the U.S., often more so than for other visa types. The goal, he maintains, is to allow those who meet the criteria to integrate and to manage the process effectively.

THE LIMITS OF TRADITIONAL DIPLOMACY AND NATION-BUILDING

Miliband critiques the record of nation-building and traditional diplomacy in addressing civil wars, citing failures in Afghanistan and the ongoing conflicts in Syria and Yemen. He posits that military or diplomatic strategies alone are insufficient without a clear vision for political settlement and compromise among internal factions. The emphasis shifts to the need for diplomacy backed by leverage—economic or political—and a consideration of regional dynamics, rather than isolated bilateral negotiations, to achieve lasting peace.

AN AGE OF IMPUNITY AND THE RETREAT FROM GLOBAL ENGAGEMENT

A critical concern raised is the emerging 'age of impunity,' where international humanitarian laws are increasingly disregarded, leading to civilian casualties and attacks on aid workers. Miliband argues that the retreat of major powers, like the U.S. and U.K. (exemplified by Brexit), lowers the standards for the exercise of power globally, creating space for abuse. This decline in commitment to human rights and accountability is seen as dangerous, particularly as unstable states continue to produce refugees and exacerbate humanitarian crises.

CHALLENGING NATIONALIST SENTIMENTS WITH GLOBAL INTERDEPENDENCE

The discussion confronts the rise of nationalism and populism, which often advocate for a focus on domestic issues. Miliband counters that addressing international challenges does not preclude attending to domestic needs, as foreign aid constitutes a small percentage of national income. He emphasizes the interconnectedness of the world, arguing that issues like pandemics, climate change, and technological risks require global solutions. A 'retreat to the citadel' is unsustainable in a globalized economy and can lead to a dystopian future of isolated fortresses. International engagement, even for superpowers, is essential for long-term security and prosperity.

COLLABORATION AMIDST DIFFERING VALUES

Miliband addresses the challenge of collaborating with countries that have poor human rights records. He clarifies that collaboration should not mean enabling repression but rather engaging constructively. Speaking up for one's values, even with autocratic regimes, is crucial for self-respect and effectiveness. While ultimatums should be used sparingly, avoiding dialogue entirely on difficult issues is counterproductive. The focus should be on strategic engagement and pursuing shared interests, such as mitigating global risks, while remaining committed to universal values where possible.

Mentioned in This Episode

●Organizations

●People Referenced

Common Questions

The IRC helps people whose lives are shattered by conflict and disaster to survive, recover, and regain control of their lives. They focus on war zones, internally displaced people, and refugees, and are also a large refugee resettlement agency in the U.S.

Topics

Foreign Policy Health & Longevity Society & Philosophy International Relations Global Security Human Rights Humanitarian Aid Refugee Crisis Politics & Policy

Mentioned in this video

Locations

Afghanistan

Country experiencing conflict, where the IRC works to provide education and where the U.S. has been involved in a long war.

Burma

Country from which Muslims have been ethnically cleansed, making it unsafe for them to return.

Saudi Arabia

Country discussed in relation to the Yemen conflict and its human rights record.

United Kingdom

Country where David Miliband served in various governmental roles, including Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs.

South Shields

Constituency in Northeast England that David Miliband represented as a Member of Parliament for 12 years.

China

Country discussed in the context of global collaboration, human rights, and potential cyber warfare threats.

Yemen

Country experiencing a severe humanitarian crisis, discussed as a failure of diplomacy and military strategy.

Germany

Country mentioned for its response to the refugee crisis, particularly Angela Merkel's policies.

Syria

Country facing conflict and civil war, where the IRC provides aid and where a significant refugee crisis originated.

Democratic Republic of Congo

Country where the IRC tackles issues like sexual violence.

People

Gordon Brown

British politician, later Prime Minister, involved in modernizing the Labour Party.

Albert Einstein

Refugee in New York in the 1930s who founded the International Rescue Committee.

Richard Haass

Author of the 'withdrawal doctrine,' which president Trump inaugurated.

Tony Blair

British politician involved in the project to modernize the Labour Party in the 1990s.

Varian Fry

The IRC's first employee who deployed to Marseille in 1940 and helped issue 2,000 passports to help Jews and intellectuals escape occupied France.

Marc Chagall

Artist who escaped occupied France to the U.S. with the help of Varian Fry and the IRC.

Ronald Reagan

U.S. President who admitted the most refugees in the early 1980s.

Yuval Harari

Author who discusses dystopian futures and the concept of a 'network of fortresses' in a globalized world.

Organizations

Taliban

Group potentially resurging in Afghanistan, posing a concern for female Afghans and U.S. strategic interests regarding havens for extremist groups.

International Rescue Committee

An American humanitarian organization founded by Albert Einstein to help refugees. It works in war zones, assists internally displaced people and refugees globally, and is the largest refugee resettlement agency in the U.S.

Trump administration

U.S. presidential administration under which bipartisan support for refugee entry was significantly reduced.

Labour Party

British political party that David Miliband was part of and helped to reform in the 1990s.

Al-Qaeda

Extremist group potentially finding haven in Afghanistan, a concern for U.S. strategic interests.