Key Moments
Sean Penn on the LA wildfires, his fears for America and filming in Kyiv while the bombs rained down
Oxford UnionKey Moments
Sean Penn likens LA wildfires to Hiroshima and fears America's political division prevents effective recovery, while criticizing the Oscars for political correctness.
Key Insights
Sean Penn described the LA wildfire devastation as "reminiscent of Hiroshima," noting that virtually everything was gone in the affected areas.
CORE, Penn's disaster relief organization, is providing cash assistance and identifying vulnerable individuals, including undocumented immigrants who may lack Social Security numbers.
Penn initially planned to document Ukrainian President Zelenskyy as a comedian-turned-president before the Russian invasion, but the documentary's focus shifted dramatically.
Penn's documentary "Superpower" captured Zelenskyy's address on the eve of the Russian invasion, with the crew experiencing the initial rocket attacks in Kyiv.
Penn expressed deep concern for America's current state, believing mainstream media has devolved into "editorial of entertainment," exacerbating internal division.
Penn criticized the Academy Awards for being "quota based" and lacking backbone, citing their handling of Ukrainian President Zelenskyy's potential address and the Will Smith incident.
LA wildfires mirror Hiroshima's devastation
Sean Penn opened by describing the recent Los Angeles wildfires as being "reminiscent of Hiroshima," with "virtually everything gone" in the affected zones. He emphasized the long road to recovery ahead and highlighted the complexities of rebuilding, including potential issues with the toxicity of the land and the urgency for regulations on green spaces and fire-resistant construction. However, he noted the "political pressure" to rebuild quickly from both leadership and residents. His organization, CORE, is focused on immediate cash assistance, particularly for the most vulnerable, including those who are undocumented and may not have Social Security numbers required for aid applications. Penn stressed that this process will be a "learning curve for everyone," with ongoing inspections and the need to avoid heavy equipment until search and recovery efforts are fully completed.
The shift in documenting Ukraine
Penn recounted the genesis of his documentary "Superpower," which began as an exploration of Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy's unlikely rise from comedian to head of state. He and his producing partner initially pursued stories about the Arab Spring and Syria, but found access limited or projects compromised. The Ukraine project was conceived pre-invasion, with a focus on Zelenskyy's "whimsical story." However, the COVID-19 pandemic delayed their initial plans. By November 2021, when they finally met Zelenskyy, the geopolitical situation was already tense, with intelligence operations underway against Wagner operatives. This was further complicated by a security leak within the presidential office. The crew managed to document parts of Ukraine, including visits to Marpole and meetings with troops and musicians, before securing a meeting with Zelenskyy on February 23, 2022 – the eve of the full-scale Russian invasion.
Filming in Kyiv during the invasion
The invasion began just as Penn and his crew were preparing to film with President Zelenskyy. They were immediately taken to a secret bunker beneath the presidential palace, experiencing the surreal reality of a city under siege. Penn described the eerie silence and the walk back to their hotel at night, advising against using car lights due to the risk of becoming a target for rockets. He reflected on the profound heartbreak of witnessing a formerly familiar populace, sharing common experiences with people in the UK or US, suddenly thrust into "this incredible horror show." The documentary ultimately captured this shift from a whimsical narrative to a raw portrayal of a nation at war, with Penn making a total of eight trips to Ukraine.
Concerns for America's political landscape
Penn expressed significant concern for the United States, stating he hopes to be wrong about his "greater concerns." He feels America has lost dignity and loyalty to aspiration, largely due to mainstream news outlets that have become "editorial of entertainment" rather than serious reporting. This, he argues, has led to dangerous internal divisions, which he observed even in the response to the LA wildfires, where he expected to see overwhelming unity but instead witnessed a "play on the division." He admitted he doesn't trust the current level of his country's support for Ukraine, despite hoping for the best for the nation and its chosen path.
Critique of the Academy Awards
Penn voiced strong criticism of the Academy Awards, describing them as "quota based" and lacking backbone, which he finds "glaring and boring." He noted that he never joined the Academy despite nominations, out of "laziness." He recalled offering President Zelenskyy a chance to speak at the awards show shortly after the invasion, highlighting Zelenskyy's desire to speak about the courage of his nation and the power of film, not politics. Penn felt the Academy traded this significant opportunity for the "slap from Will Smith to Chris Rock," suggesting they "served them right." He also referenced their historical "Blacklist" issues, stating they "cowered" and never made adequate apologies or accountability, contrasting this with his willingness to accept lifetime achievement awards for figures like Elia Kazan, provided their past actions were acknowledged.
Career as an actor and director
Reflecting on his acting career, Penn stated that his choices have often been driven by the "first 10 pages" of a script, looking for authenticity and avoiding "inauthentic conventions of film." He seeks to build a "body of work" that reflects the questions on his mind. Directing his first movie, he found a particular satisfaction in using film as a vehicle to search for answers to his own life questions, a process he found more compelling than acting alone. He expressed a desire to explore new genres, inspired by films like "Emilia Perez," and mentioned a recent positive experience working with Leonardo DiCaprio and Guillermo del Toro on a Paul Thomas Anderson film, which he is sworn not to discuss further but anticipates will be released in August.
Mentioned in This Episode
●Organizations
●People Referenced
Common Questions
CORE is providing immediate cash assistance to the most vulnerable wildfire victims, focusing on identifying and helping those who may not have access to traditional application channels due to factors like documentation status.
Topics
Mentioned in this video
Actor, director, and humanitarian, founder of CORE, discussed his work and views on various global and industry issues.
President of Syria, who Sean Penn met during a previous documentary pursuit related to the Arab Spring.
Former President of the United States, discussed in relation to the divisiveness in American politics and the culture he cultivated.
Actor with whom Sean Penn recently worked on a Paul Thomas Anderson film.
Director with whom Sean Penn recently worked on a Paul Thomas Anderson film.
Comedian who was slapped by Will Smith at the Oscars, an event discussed critically by Sean Penn in relation to the Academy's focus.
Sean Penn's producing partner on the documentary 'Superpower', who initiated contact with Volodymyr Zelenskyy.
President of Ukraine, the subject of the documentary 'Superpower', whom Penn met before and during the Russian invasion.
Director of a film Sean Penn worked on recently with Leonardo DiCaprio and Guillermo del Toro.
Actor involved in the infamous Oscars incident where he slapped Chris Rock, used as an example of the Academy's misplaced priorities.
A filmmaker who received a lifetime achievement award from the Academy, discussed in the context of acknowledging past actions and controversies.
Former student of Oxford Union, mentioned for his speech on the Academy's lack of backbone.
President of the United States, mentioned in the context of Ukrainian President Zelenskyy's potential addresses and US support for Ukraine.
Mentioned as a point of comparison for the scale of destruction caused by the LA wildfires.
The country Sean Penn's documentary 'Superpower' focuses on, particularly its president Volodymyr Zelenskyy, and the impact of the Russian invasion.
Another significant fire in the Los Angeles area mentioned in relation to the wildfire discussions.
A city in Ukraine where Sean Penn met with troops and documented the situation prior to the full-scale invasion.
One of the significant fires in the Los Angeles area discussed in the context of rebuilding challenges.
A prime location affected by fires, impacting middle-class to wealthier residents, discussed in terms of rebuilding and safety.
The country where Sean Penn attempted to make a documentary about the aftermath of the Arab Spring, involving a meeting with Bashar al-Assad.
The capital of Ukraine, where Sean Penn filmed 'Superpower' and experienced the start of the Russian invasion, including staying in a bunker.
A territory discussed in comparison to the conflict in Ukraine, highlighting differing Western responses and media coverage.
A country where Sean Penn had a false start on a documentary project, planned to focus on a figure named Kosi.
A documentary directed by Sean Penn about Volodymyr Zelenskyy, initially planned as a whimsical story of a comedian turned president, which evolved with the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
A film Sean Penn recently saw and admired, representing the kind of innovative and unseen movies he aspires to see and be part of.
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