Key Moments
Michael Malice: Christmas Special | Lex Fridman Podcast #347
Lex FridmanKey Moments
Michael Malice discusses his new book, The White Pill, exploring 20th-century evil, the fall of the Soviet Union, and the enduring nature of hope.
Key Insights
The White Pill offers a hopeful perspective amidst 20th-century evil, contrasting with nihilistic 'black pill' ideologies.
Early socialism and communism were broadly defined, with significant disagreements among proponents regarding the role of the state and violence.
Cynicism, often disguised as realism, is a pervasive societal issue that discourages aspiration and critical thinking, which can be seen in both Soviet and modern cultures.
The Soviet regime's control extended beyond propaganda to scientific and social spheres, fabricating truth and suppressing any form of dissent, including silence.
Stalin's collectivization policies, especially in Ukraine (Holodomor), were designed not only for economic control but also to break national identity through mass starvation and a culture of fear.
The collapse of the Soviet Union and the Iron Curtain exemplifies that historical outcomes are not inevitable, and that individual actions (like Gorbachev's refusal to use force) can lead to unexpected, peaceful change.
Unfettered transparency, especially through modern technology, is a powerful tool to expose propaganda and hold power centers accountable, as seen with the Twitter Files.
Self-publishing offers authors greater control and financial benefits, but also faces institutional biases and audience challenges.
INTRODUCING THE WHITE PILL: A COUNTER TO NIHILISM
Lex Fridman introduces Michael Malice’s new book, "The White Pill: A Tale of Good and Evil," which aims to provide hope amidst discussions of 20th-century atrocities. Malice explains that the 'white pill' philosophy acknowledges the existence of evil and suffering in the world but rejects the cynical apathy of the 'black pill' that suggests giving up. Instead, it encourages perseverance and belief in positive change. Fridman praises the book as a profound exploration of human nature and historical events, emphasizing Malice's unique ability to find threads of hope within dark narratives.
THE ROOTS OF SOCIALISM AND COMMUNISM (LATE 19TH/EARLY 20TH CENTURY)
At the turn of the 20th century, terms like 'socialist,' 'communist,' and 'anarchist' were used loosely. Malice describes socialism as a scientific approach to managing society, promising efficiency and an end to suffering through technological and scientific planning. Key disagreements emerged between State socialists, like Marx, who saw the state as an intermediate step to a stateless society, and anarchists, like Bakunin, who viewed the state as inherently immoral, advocating for localized worker collectives. The prevailing belief was in an inevitable, worldwide workers' revolution, where the proletariat would overthrow capitalist exploitation.
THE ROLE OF VIOLENCE AND THE APPEAL OF UTOPIAN IDEALS
The role of violence was a major point of contention. While Fabian socialists advocated for gradual, democratic change through the ballot, hardcore anarchists believed only revolution and direct action, including violence, could achieve their goals. Malice personally opposes violence, viewing it as self-perpetuating and ultimately ineffective in achieving lasting positive change, often leading to authoritarianism. He notes that the promise of communism—a society of equality, shared resources, education, and mutual care—was deeply appealing at a time of widespread poverty and injustice. This utopian vision was particularly attractive because it hadn't been tried, allowing proponents to paint a compelling picture of a better future, often appealing to intellectuals who believed in their capacity to scientifically manage society for the common good.
THE CULTURAL BIAS TOWARDS CYNICISM
Malice lambasts the pervasive cultural glorification of cynicism, where hope and happiness are often dismissed as naive or utopian. He contrasts this with the joy and benevolence of holidays like Christmas, which he sees as a rare period when people are allowed to express kindness without cynicism. He recalls being discouraged from his aspirations by family, who prioritized stability over unconventional dreams, fostering a self-critical mindset. Malice advises against surrounding oneself with people who immediately seek problems in every aspiration, stressing the importance of supportive relationships for personal and creative flourishing, regardless of the scale of success.
LENIN, THE OCTOBER REVOLUTION, AND THE BIRTH OF THE SOVIET STATE
Malice highlights the unpredictability of the October Revolution and Lenin's rise to power, which was seen as a near-miracle. Lenin, a zealot and visionary, shocked the world by establishing Bolshevik rule. Malice notes Lenin's pragmatic side, evidenced by the New Economic Policy, a strategic retreat allowing some capitalist elements to stabilize the struggling Soviet state. This pragmatism, though controversial among hardline communists, was crucial for the revolution's survival. The early Soviet period was marked by civil war and international blockade, making the Bolsheviks' hold on power precarious, and their legitimacy was initially unrecognized by many Western nations.
POWER STRUGGLES: TROTSKY VS. STALIN
After Lenin's death, a power struggle ensued between Trotsky and Stalin. Trotsky, who joined Bolshevism late, was a brilliant strategist and Lenin's initial right-hand man, advocating for a worldwide workers' revolution. Stalin, by contrast, leveraged his political acumen and connections within the party, gradually consolidating power. He championed the idea of 'socialism in one country,' a heresy to many Marxists, but a pragmatic vision for stabilizing the Soviet state. Malice explains that Trotsky's downfall was partly due to his unwavering belief in the party's infallibility, which prevented him from effectively opposing Stalin. Additionally, Trotsky's Jewish background posed a significant obstacle in an inherently anti-Semitic system, a factor Stalin exploited.
THE CULT OF PERSONALITY AND THE ENEMY WITHIN
Stalin cultivated a supernatural image, portraying Trotsky as an omnipresent enemy responsible for all Soviet failures—an idea brilliantly satirized in Orwell's "Animal Farm" and "1984." This constant need for a scapegoat, whether 'kulaks,' 'wreckers,' or 'doctors,' maintained the illusion of ideological purity while deflecting blame for systemic issues. Malice notes that in totalitarian regimes, when ideology clashes with reality, an internal enemy is invented to explain discrepancies. Eventually, merely noticing or acknowledging problems became a form of treason, forcing citizens into a collective delusion, where objective truth was replaced by officially sanctioned narratives.
SUPPRESSION OF SPEECH AND FABRICATION OF TRUTH
Malice details how the Soviet regime used censorship and control of media to manipulate public opinion, propagating monotonous narratives of success and greatness while suppressing dissent. He recounts a Russian joke about trusting newspapers over one's own eyes, illustrating the profound disconnect between reported 'truth' and reality. This propaganda extended to science, with Lysenkoism denying genetics to align with materialist Marxist ideology, leading to absurd and damaging scientific programs. The psychological impact was so severe that many citizens internalized the official narrative, as exemplified by a North Korean refugee who believed a dictator's tumor was a war injury until challenged.
DISCUSSION ON FREE SPEECH IN THE MODERN ERA
Malice expresses his dislike for the term 'free speech' due to its varied and often misused interpretations. However, he strongly advocates for transparency in information dissemination, particularly enabled by modern technology. He praises Elon Musk's release of the 'Twitter Files,' which exposed the machinations behind content moderation, revealing how powerful entities sculpt narratives and suppress information, often disingenuously. Malice argues that such transparency is crucial for holding power centers accountable and allowing individuals to make informed decisions, contrasting it with the Soviet Union's state-controlled media where dissent was impossible and truth was fabricated. He views the ability for anyone to capture and spread information instantly as a vital tool against propaganda.
STALIN'S COLLECTIVIZATION AND THE HOLODOMOR
Stalin’s collectivization policies aimed to consolidate agricultural land and resources, but also served to break the spirit of independent Ukrainian identity. The infamous Holodomor, or forced famine in Ukraine during the 1930s, resulted in millions of deaths. Malice explains that this starvation was a deliberate act, fueled by an artificial narrative that 'kulaks' (wealthy peasants) were hoarding grain, justifying their brutal deportation and execution. Activists confiscated food, leaving no grain for planting and starving entire villages. The reintroduction of internal passports trapped people in their dying villages, creating a climate where even showing sympathy to a starving person could be deemed treason, leading to widespread cannibalism and the systematic dehumanization of the population.
FAILURE OF WESTERN JOURNALISM DURING THE HOLODOMOR
Malice criticizes Western journalists, particularly Walter Duranty of the New York Times, for denying the existence of the Holodomor. These journalists, often pro-Soviet and reliant on Soviet censors for access, either pre-censored themselves or actively propagated the regime's lies. Duranty, a Pulitzer Prize winner, dismissed reports of famine as overblown or traditional Russian hardship, even attacking journalists like Gareth Jones, who risked his life to expose the truth. Malice attributes this journalistic failure to a combination of professional pressure, fear of deportation, ideological alignment, and a desire for 'access' that superseded journalistic integrity. He contrasts this with today's ubiquitous cell phone cameras, which make concealing such atrocities far more difficult.
THE GREAT TERROR, THE GULAG, AND THE BUREAUCRACY OF FEAR
Stalin's Great Terror systematically dismantled any social bonds that could threaten his power, including family and friendships. People were encouraged to inform on neighbors, and confessions, often extracted through brutal torture of adults and even children, led to endless chains of arrests. Malice recounts chilling stories of children as young as 11 being tortured into naming 'accomplices.' Ethnicity was also targeted, with entire populations deported. The NKVD, led by the utterly depraved Lavrentiy Beria, became a vast bureaucracy of terror, operating on the principle of 'show me the man and I'll show you the crime.' Even being late for work became a felony. This pervasive fear ensured absolute compliance, where the only safe option was to fully embrace the regime's narrative, even if it meant denying observable reality.
THE FALL OF THE IRON CURTAIN: GRADUALLY THEN SUDDENLY
Malice describes the collapse of the Soviet Union and the Iron Curtain as a stunning demonstration of individual agency and the unpredictable nature of history. He credits Mikhail Gorbachev's decision not to use force against dissenting satellite states, rejecting the Brezhnev Doctrine, as the pivotal factor. Gorbachev, having witnessed Stalin's atrocities, was a committed communist but increasingly skeptical of authoritarianism. This shift allowed movements like Poland's Solidarity to liberalize peacefully. The domino effect that followed, from Hungary and Czechoslovakia to the fall of the Berlin Wall, surprised even Western leaders who had deemed such rapid, peaceful change impossible. This historical event, Malice argues, underscores that even entrenched totalitarian systems can dissolve, often suddenly and with less bloodshed than anticipated.
THE POWER OF TRUTH AND THE SHOCK OF REALITY
Malice highlights the profound impact of truth in dismantling the Soviet narrative, exemplified by Boris Yeltsin's visit to a Houston supermarket. Witnessing the abundance of food, even for ordinary citizens, Yeltsin realized the depth of the lies fed to the Russian people. This personal revelation, seeing ordinary goods like large onions readily available, shattered a lifetime of propaganda, causing a kind of 'brain reprogramming .' Malice argues that the Soviet Union's downfall was ultimately an intellectual victory: once people had access to information and saw the stark contrast between their reality and the outside world, the ideological facade crumbled. The widespread access to food, information, and freedom to travel, even if imperfect, marked a significant step forward for millions, offering a tangible "win" to take away from such a dark century, a testament to the enduring power of hope and truth.
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Common Questions
Michael Malice's new book explores the profound evil of the 20th century, particularly focusing on the Soviet Union and communism, while also revealing a thread of hope he calls 'the white pill,' an acknowledgment of evil without giving up on the world.
Topics
Mentioned in this video
Michael Malice's book discussing different ideologies of anarchism, which he also self-published.
Anonymous self-published diary with an introduction by Gareth Jones, detailing his travels in Russia and what he encountered during the famine.
Anne Applebaum's book detailing the Stalin-imposed famine in Ukraine and the historical context of Russian-Ukrainian relations.
Another book by Michael Malice, focusing on extreme political movements in the United States.
Michael Malice's new book, which explores the darkest aspects of 20th-century evil, particularly in the Soviet Union, while offering a message of hope.
One of Michael Malice's previous books, a story of North Korea, which he also self-published.
A pamphlet or short book by Murray Rothbard, which Amazon cited as too similar to Michael Malice's 'Anarchist Handbook,' blocking its hardcover release.
Timothy Snyder's book, recommended for its research into atrocities, including cannibalism during the Stalin-imposed famine.
Victor Sebestyen's book about the year 1989, documenting the rapid and peaceful liberalization of Eastern European countries, inspiring Michael Malice's focus on hope.
Albert Camus's novel, which Michael Malice quotes at the beginning of 'The White Pill' regarding morality and the duty not to join forces with plagues.
Albert Camus's philosophical essay, which Michael Malice reread and initially thought of as a framework for his book.
George Orwell's allegorical novella, where Trotsky is portrayed as 'Snowball,' an embodiment of evil used by the ruling class to maintain power.
Chemical explosive whose creation exponentially increased the danger and threat of violence in the late 19th/early 20th century.
Animation studio whose films are mentioned as examples of joyous and happy stories, contrasted with dark and despairing narratives.
Media company Matt Walsh works for, known for its conservative content.
Country referenced as an example of democratic socialism, contrasted with Venezuela's outcome.
Country mentioned in a 'Steel Man' argument for socialism, where initial votes for socialism led to negative outcomes rather than a Swedish model.
U.S. President whose assassination is cited as an example of common violence in the early 20th century.
Anarchist who attended Mabel Dodge Luhan's salon and later became disillusioned with the Bolshevik Revolution.
Writer and critic, friends with the intellectuals who attended Mabel Dodge Luhan's salon.
U.S. President, instrumental alongside Margaret Thatcher, in the safe dismantling of the Iron Curtain; believed in winning the Cold War and saw Gorbachev as a potential partner.
U.S. President criticized for prolonging the Great Depression in the United States.
Comedian Michael Malice uses as a generic example of a 'failed comedian' with a podcast, likely an ironic reference.
From The Daily Wire, known for his documentary 'What Is a Woman?' praised for letting people speak despite his aggressive online persona.
Author quoted for his line about the difficulty of convincing someone of something if his payroll depends on him not being convinced.
Former Soviet leader, referred to as the 'big hero' of 'The White Pill' for resisting authoritarianism and his role in the peaceful liberalization of Eastern Europe.
Historian who wrote 'Red Famine,' a significant work on the Holodomor and the history of Ukraine, despite contemporary political disagreements with Malice.
Biologist whose work on genetics was rejected by Lysenkoism in the Soviet Union.
Collaborator with Marx, who shared the vision of the state withering away after man's nature was remade.
Economist who pointed out that human beings are not even equal to themselves over time, let alone to one another, challenging the literal interpretation of equality.
German general who orchestrated Lenin's return to Russia to destabilize the Eastern Front during WWI, not anticipating the Bolsheviks' success.
Author whose novels are mentioned for their philosophical depth, drawing a comparison to 'Fight Club.'
Professional journalist, described as a 'lefty,' who was given access to the 'Twitter Files' by Elon Musk.
Author whose book was self-published with the help of Tucker Max's company.
New York Times journalist, Pulitzer Prize winner, who denied the Holodomor famine and actively undermined journalists like Gareth Jones, later admitting he was 'kind of wrong.'
Leading figure in the Bolsheviks, whose views (such as a worldwide workers' revolution) differed from Stalin's 'socialism in one country.' He was later demonized as a scapegoat by Stalin.
Russian poet, whose work 'Eugene Onegin' was falsely confessed to by a tortured child in a joke about the Soviet secret police's methods.
Stalin's successor, who, despite having blood on his hands, exposed Stalin's atrocities in a 'secret speech' in 1956 and initiated the shrinking of the gulags.
Anarchist who disagreed with Marx, regarding the state as immoral and advocating for workers' collectives and localized control.
Author of 'American Splendor,' who became friends with Michael Malice and was writing a graphic novel about him.
His actions with Twitter, particularly releasing the 'Twitter Files' and prioritizing child pornography removal, are greatly admired for promoting transparency.
Professional journalist, described as a 'lefty,' who was given access to the 'Twitter Files' by Elon Musk.
Anarchist author whose work 'Anatomy of the State' was cited by Amazon as too similar to Michael Malice's 'Anarchist Handbook,' preventing its hardcover publication.
Friend of Michael Malice who had a company that helped people self-publish books, including David Goggins' book.
Jordan Peterson's daughter, mentioned by Michael Malice as a good friend and named after Mikhail Gorbachev.
Headed an American organization that provided famine relief in early 20th century Russia but withdrew due to Bolsheviks selling grain rather than feeding their people.
Author whose autobiography starts with 'I was a good boy,' mentioned by Michael Malice as not being 'a very good boy.'
His laptop contents were the subject of a controversial New York Post article that was suppressed on Twitter.
Author of 'Bloodlands,' which briefly but well-researched discusses cannibalism during the Stalin-imposed famine.
Heir to the Heinz fortune who traveled with Gareth Jones in Russia and signed the book 'Experiences in Russia, 1931,' which Michael Malice acquired.
Philosopher who wrote 'The Plague' and 'The Myth of Sisyphus,' whose quote about plagues and victims introduces Malice's book, inspiring ethical considerations against violence.
Head of the NKVD, described as one of the most evil people, known for sadism, mass rape, expanding the gulag, and his quote 'Show me the man and I'll show you the crime.'
Author of 'The White Pill,' 'Dear Reader,' 'The New Right,' and 'The Anarchist Handbook.' Known for his comedic genius and critical perspective on politics and philosophy.
U.S. President associated with progressive ideas, believing technology and science could manage society efficiently.
Anarchist who published a book in the 1800s on how to build dynamite and bombs, raising early free speech concerns.
His assassination triggered the start of World War I, highlighting the prevalence of violence at the time.
Woman who hosted a salon in Manhattan where intellectuals like Emma Goldman and Margaret Sanger would meet and discuss ideas at the birth of modernism.
Founder of Planned Parenthood and advocate for birth control, who also attended Mabel Dodge Luhan's salon.
Leader of the Bolshevik Revolution, described as a zealot and visionary with strategic pragmatism, whose seizure of power was seen as miraculous and unprecedented.
Lenin's successor, who cunningly worked the party system, advocating 'socialism in one country.' He implemented purges, torture, and collectivization leading to mass suffering and death.
Leader whose rise may have been influenced by post-WWI hyperinflation, and who later betrayed Stalin.
Famous podcaster used as an example of a 'massive superstar' in the context of aspiring creators not needing to reach his level to be successful.
Theorist whose ideas of a 'prophecied Marxist Society' and 'state withering away' influenced early socialist, communist, and anarchist thought.
Comedian who shared an anecdote about Patrice O'Neal's critique of 'Fight Club.'
Late comedian who critiqued 'Fight Club' as 'the whitest book on Earth.'
Discussed at length regarding his views on self-publishing, along with his daughter Mikhaila.
Western journalist who bravely exposed the Holodomor by walking through the Ukrainian countryside, contradicting the official narrative, and was later killed.
Another Western journalist who, alongside Gareth Jones, exposed the Soviet famine, facing difficulties finding work thereafter.
Author of 'Fight Club,' who reportedly admitted the movie was better than the book.
Individual who championed the issue of child pornography and exploitation on Twitter, pushing for its removal.
Founder of North Korea, who had a tumor on his neck that was obscured from public knowledge, an example of ideological control where citizens believed official lies.
Author who brilliantly portrayed Trotsky as 'Snowball' in 'Animal Farm' and 'Emmanuel Goldstein' in '1984,' illustrating the need for an enemy figure in totalitarian regimes.
Chinese leader who caused many executions and starvation during the Great Leap Forward, a historical event lacking a clear 'call to action' for news narratives.
Conservative media personality who runs a network called The Blaze, where Michael Malice works.
Prime Minister of the UK, instrumental alongside Ronald Reagan, in guiding the Cold War to a safe landing. She lectured Gorbachev on human rights and economics.
President of Russia after the Soviet Union's fall, deeply affected by witnessing the abundance in an American supermarket, realizing the extent of Soviet lies.
French writer; his friendship with a foreigner became grounds for arrest and accusations of being a spy in the Soviet Union.
Poet and author, whose words about anything being possible are used to close the podcast.
U.S. President who is controversially shown raising a toast to Mao, highlighting the complex historical narratives that often lack clear villains or heroes.
Historian and author of 'Revolution 1989,' a key inspiration for Michael Malice, detailing the peaceful liberalization of Eastern European countries.
Head of West Germany, who laughed at Wałęsa's prediction about the Berlin Wall's fall, only for it to happen the next day.
Leader of the Solidarity movement in Poland, who met with Margaret Thatcher and later discussed the fall of the Berlin Wall with Helmut Kohl.
Traditional publishing house, mentioned in contrast to self-publishing.
News outlet whose article about the Hunter Biden laptop was suppressed by Twitter, highlighting censorship issues.
Traditional publishing house, mentioned in contrast to self-publishing, where authors might receive a smaller advance for less success.
Traditional publishing house, mentioned in contrast to self-publishing.
Online retail giant where Michael Malice's book 'The White Pill' is available for purchase; also discussed in the context of self-publishing.
Social media platform where discussion of transparency, free speech, and content moderation under Elon Musk's leadership is a key topic.
Supermarket visited by Boris Yeltsin, whose abundance of food deeply impacted him by revealing the lies of Soviet propaganda. Now a Food Town.
Current name of the supermarket formerly known as Randall's, visited by Boris Yeltsin.
Ice cream chain, mentioned as Michael Malice's preferred ice cream, contrasted with Soviet ice cream.
E-commerce website offering opportunities for independent artists, seen as a wonderful aspect of modern life.
Ice cream company praised by Michael Malice for doing 'great work.'
Newspaper that downplayed or ignored the Hunter Biden laptop story, later comforting Twitter's censorship of it.
Hardcore labor unions whose members participated in intellectual salons at the turn of the 20th century.
Political party in Great Britain that emerged from the Fabian socialists.
Organization that granted permission to Michael Malice to reprint portions of 'Anatomy of the State' in 'Anarchist Handbook.'
Soviet secret police, later referred to in the context of people being arrested.
Labor union movement in Poland that gained widespread support and strikes, eventually leading to Poland's liberalization and freedom with minimal bloodshed.
Network run by Glenn Beck where Michael Malice is employed, highlighting a conservative media environment.
Military alliance of Eastern European communist states, subservient to Moscow, whose control began to crumble with events like the Hungarian and Prague Springs.
Movie based on the work of Harvey Pekar.
Matt Walsh's documentary exploring gender theory and identity, praised for its surprising quality and allowing interviewees to speak.
Film discussed as being better than its book, capturing a certain anger and angst in society, depicting a 'white book' according to Patrice O'Neal.
The podcast hosting this conversation, also referred to as 'Luxe Friedman podcast' in the transcript.
Science fiction series referenced as an example of popular culture that, even in a far future, depicted the continued existence of America and the Soviet Union, reflecting the 'realpolitik' of the time.
The Cold War theory that if one country in a region came under communist control, then other neighboring countries would follow, which proved true in reverse during the collapse of communism.
A pseudoscientific biological theory favored in the Soviet Union that rejected genes due to Marxism's materialist nature, making Soviet biology an international laughingstock.
Soviet foreign policy stating that socialist nations had a duty to intervene in other socialist countries to prevent counter-revolutions, demonstrated in Hungary (1956) and Czechoslovakia (1968).
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